{"id":138347,"date":"2019-03-20T00:07:10","date_gmt":"2019-03-20T06:07:10","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/?p=138347"},"modified":"2019-03-20T00:07:10","modified_gmt":"2019-03-20T06:07:10","slug":"how-too-many-people-learn-all-they-ever-learn-about-islam","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2019\/03\/20\/how-too-many-people-learn-all-they-ever-learn-about-islam.html","title":{"rendered":"How too many people learn all they ever learn about Islam"},"content":{"rendered":"

Using a meme as a basis for learning about a complex faith system is … well, kind of goofy. Especially when it’s a meme based scriptural translations by people who have left that faith and want to put forward the message that it’s dangerous (with further modifications to attack a Muslim politician).<\/p>\n

(Consider whether folk who are willing to believe such Quranic interpretations would be so fast to accept Biblical translations from ex-Christians who were avowed enemies of their former faith.)<\/p>\n

\"\"<\/a><\/p>\n

This FactCheck post<\/a> looks at a meme that’s been floating around for a while, with gobs of reposts on (of course) Facebook. It looks at some scholarly opinions of the passages quoted (or paraphrased, or misquoted) as well as providing a more scholarly-accepted translation.<\/p>\n

In pretty much every case, the translation and meaning ascribed is, where not deceptive, certainly not the commonly accepted meaning.<\/p>\n

In many of those passages, it is worth noting that a chunk of the Quran does dwell on armed conflict — part and parcel of Muhammad’s history.\u00a0 I won’t act as an apologist for Islam or the writings ascribed to the Prophet. But … well, consider:<\/p>\n

On this account I, or rather the Lord, beseech you as Christ’s heralds to publish this everywhere and to persuade all people of whatever rank, foot-soldiers and knights, poor and rich, to carry aid promptly to those Christians and to destroy that vile race from the lands of our friends. I say this to those who are present, it meant also for those who are absent. Moreover, Christ commands it.<\/em><\/p>\n

All who die by the way, whether by land or by sea, or in battle against the pagans, shall have immediate remission of sins. This I grant them through the power of God with which I am invested. O what a disgrace if such a despised and base race, which worships demons, should conquer a people which has the faith of omnipotent God and is made glorious with the name of Christ! With what reproaches will the Lord overwhelm us if you do not aid those who, with us, profess the Christian religion! Let those who have been accustomed unjustly to wage private warfare against the faithful now go against the infidels and end with victory this war which should have been begun long ago.<\/p><\/blockquote>\n

That was a sermon by Pope Urban II<\/a> at the Council of Clermont in 1095, widely re-preached across all of Western Europe, speaking on behalf of God,\u00a0<\/em>to urge all of Christendom to launch the First Crusade to the “Holy Land,” to wrest it from the Muslims. The language is … well, not unlike that ascribed to Muhammed, and in similar circumstances, and it initiated a century of bloody warfare in the Near East.<\/p>\n

Now, it’s certainly true that there are some Muslims today who do preach from some of these passages just as they are dubiously translated here, to attack non-Muslims, or attack Muslims who aren’t of the “right” denomination, or to generally stir up hatred (and justify their own hatreds) and violence. From al-Qa’eda to ISIL, there are those people who parse out hatred and calls to war in the Quran as a basis for their own actions.<\/p>\n

But Christians who want to take on airs of superiority (or fearmongering)\u00a0 over such things should consider how the Gospel of Christ (let alone passages in the Old Testament) have been used by Christians over the centuries to justify everything from wars of conquest, to oppression and torture over doctrinal differences, to pogroms, to chattel slavery. Even in modern times, Christian Scripture has been used to justify racial segregation, oppression of Jews, inequality of women, jailing of gay people, and, yes, warfare and violence.<\/p>\n

And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother’s eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye?<\/p><\/blockquote>\n

“But those aren’t true interpretations of the Gospel, Dave! They’re twisted and distorted readings used to justify base emotions and hurtful passions. You can’t blame Christianity for those who have used its message to further their own hateful ends.”<\/p>\n

Just so. And thus endeth the lesson.<\/p>\n

Do you want to know more?\u00a0<\/em>Meme Distorts Quran Verses – FactCheck.org<\/a><\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"

Memes can be funny. But, really, people, they aren’t truly educational, let alone accurate.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":2,"featured_media":138349,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"_seopress_titles_title":"","_seopress_titles_desc":"","_seopress_robots_index":"","_seopress_robots_follow":"","_seopress_robots_imageindex":"","_seopress_robots_snippet":"","_seopress_robots_primary_cat":"","_seopress_robots_breadcrumbs":"","_seopress_robots_freeze_modified_date":"","_seopress_robots_custom_modified_date":"","_seopress_robots_canonical":"","_seopress_social_fb_title":"","_seopress_social_fb_desc":"","_seopress_social_fb_img":"","_seopress_social_fb_img_attachment_id":0,"_seopress_social_fb_img_width":0,"_seopress_social_fb_img_height":0,"_seopress_social_twitter_title":"","_seopress_social_twitter_desc":"","_seopress_social_twitter_img":"","_seopress_social_twitter_img_attachment_id":0,"_seopress_social_twitter_img_width":0,"_seopress_social_twitter_img_height":0,"_seopress_redirections_value":"","_seopress_redirections_enabled":"","_seopress_redirections_enabled_regex":"","_seopress_redirections_logged_status":"","_seopress_redirections_param":"","_seopress_redirections_type":0,"_seopress_analysis_target_kw":"","_jetpack_memberships_contains_paid_content":false,"footnotes":"","jetpack_publicize_message":"","jetpack_publicize_feature_enabled":true,"jetpack_social_post_already_shared":true,"jetpack_social_options":{"image_generator_settings":{"template":"highway","default_image_id":0,"font":"","enabled":false},"version":2}},"categories":[3,108,378,110],"tags":[],"class_list":["post-138347","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-blogging","category-history","category-intolerance-persecution","category-religious-zanies"],"jetpack_publicize_connections":[],"jetpack_featured_media_url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/03\/quran-meme.jpg","jetpack_sharing_enabled":true,"jetpack-related-posts":[{"id":133579,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2017\/05\/31\/official-religious-prejudice-can-be-expensive.html","url_meta":{"origin":138347,"position":0},"title":"Official religious prejudice can be expensive","author":"***Dave","date":"Wed 31-May-17 9:24am","format":false,"excerpt":"The intersection between land use laws and zoning regulations on one side, and churches on the other, can get complicated and contentious. But if it looks like you're making things difficult for a particular church because of the faith it represents, that contentiousness can turn into a big law suit\u2026","rel":"","context":"In "~PlusPosts"","block_context":{"text":"~PlusPosts","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/blogging\/plusposts"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":45054,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2014\/09\/09\/tagged-for-ten-books.html","url_meta":{"origin":138347,"position":1},"title":"Tagged for Ten Books","author":"***Dave","date":"Tue 9-Sep-14 2:21pm","format":false,"excerpt":"Over on That Other Social Network (at http:\/\/goo.gl\/ZLnEKC), +DeAnna Knippling tagged me for a meme to list \"10 books that have stayed with me, changed my life, or were for other reasons memorable.\"In no particular order ...1. The Lord of the Rings (Tolkien) - For a book that took me\u2026","rel":"","context":"In "~PlusPosts"","block_context":{"text":"~PlusPosts","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/blogging\/plusposts"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2014\/09\/Library-with-a-book-ladde-0145B15D.jpgimgmax%3D660.jpg?resize=350%2C200&ssl=1","width":350,"height":200,"srcset":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2014\/09\/Library-with-a-book-ladde-0145B15D.jpgimgmax%3D660.jpg?resize=350%2C200&ssl=1 1x, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2014\/09\/Library-with-a-book-ladde-0145B15D.jpgimgmax%3D660.jpg?resize=525%2C300&ssl=1 1.5x"},"classes":[]},{"id":12890,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2008\/09\/12\/diminishing_ourselves_and.html","url_meta":{"origin":138347,"position":2},"title":"“Diminishing ourselves and our faith”","author":"***Dave","date":"Fri 12-Sep-08 4:18pm","format":false,"excerpt":"And here's another one Ginny flagged that deserves its own post, since it really does speak for me: A religious liberal looks at \"Christianists\" Money quote: Voters and leaders get...","rel":"","context":"In "Episcopal Church"","block_context":{"text":"Episcopal Church","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/religion\/religion-episcopal-church"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":12682,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2008\/02\/26\/faith_snapshot.html","url_meta":{"origin":138347,"position":3},"title":"Faith snapshot","author":"***Dave","date":"Tue 26-Feb-08 10:46am","format":false,"excerpt":"\u00a0Les points to a new, massive Pew Research report on the state of religion in the US. Bottom line: it's a diverse picture, and getting moreso over time. A...","rel":"","context":"In "Religion"","block_context":{"text":"Religion","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/religion"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/www.hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/images\/pew-religion.gif?resize=350%2C200&ssl=1","width":350,"height":200},"classes":[]},{"id":127887,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2015\/09\/04\/laws-oaths-faith-and-kim-davis.html","url_meta":{"origin":138347,"position":4},"title":"Laws, Oaths, Faith, and Kim Davis","author":"***Dave","date":"Fri 4-Sep-15 5:37pm","format":false,"excerpt":"For those who are couching the Kim Davis debate as one of religious freedom (I'm raising an eyebrow at you, Messrs. Cruz and Huckabee), two questions:1. Should a Kentucky county clerk have been allowed to issue marriage licenses to same-sex couples, before Obergefell made it legal, using the excuse of\u2026","rel":"","context":"In "~PlusPosts"","block_context":{"text":"~PlusPosts","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/blogging\/plusposts"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":18752,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2010\/09\/29\/musings-on-the-quran.html","url_meta":{"origin":138347,"position":5},"title":"Musings on the Qur’an","author":"***Dave","date":"Wed 29-Sep-10 9:15pm","format":false,"excerpt":"Commentary on a holy book that isn't of my faith tradition is sort of like walking into someone's house and criticizing their decor. \u00a0It's not only rude, it presupposes one's own taste is better than theirs, or what they like and enjoy and find comfortable is somehow suspect because it\u2026","rel":"","context":"In "Books"","block_context":{"text":"Books","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/media\/media-books"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/09\/koran.jpg?resize=350%2C200&ssl=1","width":350,"height":200},"classes":[]}],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/138347","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/2"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=138347"}],"version-history":[{"count":1,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/138347\/revisions"}],"predecessor-version":[{"id":138350,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/138347\/revisions\/138350"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/138349"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=138347"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=138347"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=138347"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}