{"id":19368,"date":"2010-12-01T22:56:11","date_gmt":"2010-12-02T05:56:11","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/?p=19368"},"modified":"2010-12-01T22:56:11","modified_gmt":"2010-12-02T05:56:11","slug":"discarding-reason-for-the-season","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2010\/12\/01\/discarding-reason-for-the-season.html","title":{"rendered":"Discarding Reason for the Season"},"content":{"rendered":"<p>So after discussing the Evils of Atheistic Billboards <a href=\"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2010\/11\/30\/defensiveness-for-christ.html\">yesterday<\/a> (or, more properly, the hypocrisy of Christians condemning Atheists for proselytization efforts), a few more items bobbed up on the subject. \u00a0Like this billboard:<\/p>\n<p><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"aligncenter size-full wp-image-19369\" title=\"You KNOW it's a Myth\" src=\"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/mythbillboard.jpeg\" alt=\"\" width=\"500\" height=\"144\" srcset=\"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/mythbillboard.jpeg 500w, https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/mythbillboard-300x86.jpg 300w, https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/mythbillboard-160x46.jpg 160w, https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/mythbillboard-75x21.jpg 75w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 500px) 85vw, 500px\" \/><\/p>\n<p>It came up at <a href=\"http:\/\/feedproxy.google.com\/~r\/scienceblogs\/pharyngula\/~3\/fTQaabeQnXQ\/get_over_yourselves_timid_athe.php\">this page<\/a> at Pharyngula in conjunction with PZ Myers objecting to an atheist with Christian family \u00a0members who objected to the billboard as simply being provocative. \u00a0Les shared the article in Google Reader, and I commented:<\/p>\n<blockquote><p>Isn&#8217;t there a difference, though, between at least sometimes &#8220;letting people go about their daily lives in peace&#8221; and &#8220;bowing and scraping and saying &#8216;Yassuh&#8217; to the religious&#8221;?<\/p>\n<p>My main problem with this particular ad is that, I don&#8217;t like anyone telling me what I &#8220;KNOW&#8221;. In some ways, this strikes me as the flip side to &#8220;Even atheists know in their hearts that God is real&#8221; crap.<\/p>\n<p>Reminding theists that atheists are real, that they are good people, even that they disagree, is in fact a good thing. It&#8217;s also good (as noted yesterday) to let people who aren&#8217;t believers know that there are kindred spirits out there. Telling people, at Christmas, that their beliefs about Christmas are a myth (and that, arguably, they KNOW it to be true) strikes me as being unnecessarily rude.<\/p><\/blockquote>\n<p>That said, I then ran across today <a href=\"http:\/\/defendchristians.org\/news\/atheist-group-singles-out-christian-holidays\/\">this even more pathetically maddening article<\/a> on the subject, from the &#8220;Christian Anti-Defamation Commission.&#8221; \u00a0And this one deserves (sigh) a lengthy screed.<\/p>\n<p>Now, if the CADC was focused on pointing out places where Christians were, in fact, unfairly defamed, pointing out how that was the case, and asking that people of goodwill join in stopping such\u00a0occurrences, I&#8217;d be all over that.<\/p>\n<figure id=\"attachment_19383\" aria-describedby=\"caption-attachment-19383\" style=\"width: 300px\" class=\"wp-caption alignright\"><a href=\"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/tongues-sticking-out.jpg\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"size-medium wp-image-19383\" title=\"Tongues sticking out\" src=\"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/tongues-sticking-out-300x199.jpg\" alt=\"\" width=\"300\" height=\"199\" srcset=\"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/tongues-sticking-out-300x199.jpg 300w, https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/tongues-sticking-out-160x106.jpg 160w, https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/tongues-sticking-out-75x49.jpg 75w, https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/tongues-sticking-out-500x332.jpg 500w, https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/tongues-sticking-out.jpg 600w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 300px) 85vw, 300px\" \/><\/a><figcaption id=\"caption-attachment-19383\" class=\"wp-caption-text\">Double poopy-heads!<\/figcaption><\/figure>\n<p>Instead, the CADC&#8217;s MO is basically to screech, &#8220;<strong>Hey! They called us poopy-heads! \u00a0But they&#8217;re <em>double <\/em>poopy-heads!<\/strong>&#8221; Which is, of course, just what Jesus indicated one should do and feel when being <a href=\"http:\/\/www.biblegateway.com\/passage\/?search=Matthew%205:11-12&amp;version=NIV\">persecuted for His sake<\/a>, right?<\/p>\n<blockquote><p>As we enter the Christmas season, atheist groups are lining up again to bash Christianity.<\/p><\/blockquote>\n<p><em>Some <\/em>atheist groups are interested in &#8220;bashing&#8221; Christianity, for a variety of reasons. \u00a0They don&#8217;t usually restrict themselves to the Christmas season.<\/p>\n<blockquote><p>A group called\u00a0<em>American Atheists<\/em> purchased a billboard in New Jersey that shows a silhouette of the Three Wise Men approaching the Nativity. Underneath is written, \u201cYou KNOW it\u2019s a Myth. This Season, Celebrate REASON!\u201d<\/p><\/blockquote>\n<p>Well, that much is accurate.<\/p>\n<figure id=\"attachment_19372\" aria-describedby=\"caption-attachment-19372\" style=\"width: 260px\" class=\"wp-caption alignright\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"size-full wp-image-19372\" title=\"Epiphany\" src=\"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/3_wisemen.png\" alt=\"\" width=\"260\" height=\"225\" srcset=\"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/3_wisemen.png 260w, https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/3_wisemen-160x138.png 160w, https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/3_wisemen-75x64.png 75w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 260px) 85vw, 260px\" \/><figcaption id=\"caption-attachment-19372\" class=\"wp-caption-text\">It&#39;s not a myth, it&#39;s just Cliff&#39;s Notes<\/figcaption><\/figure>\n<p><a href=\"http:\/\/www.biblegateway.com\/passage\/?search=Matthew+2&amp;version=NIV\">Biblically speaking<\/a>, of course, the Wise Men men did not arrive while the newborn Jesus lay in the manger. \u00a0Nor were there canonically three of them. Nor do they even appear in more than just one of the Gospels. \u00a0So, even from a Biblical standpoint, the whole &#8220;We Three Kings of Orient Are&#8221; <em>is <\/em>a myth within Christianity. \u00a0But that&#8217;s not quite the intent of the billboard, I suspect, and, mysteriously, the CADC would probably handwave away that aspect of it, so I suppose I digress.<\/p>\n<blockquote><p>It\u2019s interesting that this same hostility isn\u2019t displayed against Muslims during Ramadan or towards Jews during their Holy Days.<\/p><\/blockquote>\n<p>Well, despite fear of Muslims taking over America, or fear of the overwhelming power of Jews in the media, both groups remain tiny percentages of the population and of the culture. \u00a0If one is out to object to religious myths, it makes sense to take on the big dog in the yard.<\/p>\n<p>That said, atheists do, as appropriate, criticize Muslims and Jews. \u00a0It&#8217;s hardly surprising that the CADC doesn&#8217;t actually notice this.\u00a0Especially as \u00a0the CADC probably sees this as some huge crypto-Atheist-Muslim-Jewish conspiracy against Jesus. \u00a0So it goes.<\/p>\n<blockquote><p>Apparently the American Atheists are ignorant of the fact that history proves Christ\u2019s birth is not a myth.<\/p><\/blockquote>\n<figure id=\"attachment_19374\" aria-describedby=\"caption-attachment-19374\" style=\"width: 230px\" class=\"wp-caption alignright\"><a href=\"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/jesus-white.jpg\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"size-medium wp-image-19374\" title=\"Pearly-white Jesus\" src=\"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/jesus-white-230x300.jpg\" alt=\"\" width=\"230\" height=\"300\" srcset=\"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/jesus-white-230x300.jpg 230w, https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/jesus-white-122x160.jpg 122w, https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/jesus-white-57x75.jpg 57w, https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/jesus-white.jpg 302w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 230px) 85vw, 230px\" \/><\/a><figcaption id=\"caption-attachment-19374\" class=\"wp-caption-text\">Plus, Jesus is pearly-white and rosy-cheeked and CERTAINLY not swarthy or Semetic<\/figcaption><\/figure>\n<p>Despite fervent assertions to the contrary, the <a href=\"http:\/\/en.wikipedia.org\/wiki\/Historicity_of_Jesus\">historical basis for Jesus<\/a> is hardly as settled as that, let alone the specific events surrounding his birth. The last time I looked, there was at least some basis for Jesus&#8217; historicity, but not not so much as to assert &#8220;ignorance&#8221; of the &#8220;fact&#8221; of the &#8220;proof.&#8221;<\/p>\n<p><a href=\"http:\/\/en.wikisource.org\/wiki\/Bible_(King_James)\/John#20:2\">But, then<\/a>, &#8220;blessed are you who have not seen, but have believed.&#8221;<\/p>\n<blockquote><p>Jesus is not only the promised Messiah, God born of human flesh, he is the crucified and risen Savior of the World.<\/p><\/blockquote>\n<p>Which isn&#8217;t exactly arguing from <em>history<\/em>.<\/p>\n<blockquote><p>Over three hundred fulfilled biblical prophecies, corroborated by non-Christian sources and eyewitness testimony are stubborn facts atheists simply pretend aren\u2019t there.<\/p><\/blockquote>\n<p>Wow. \u00a0Really? \u00a0I mean, sure, the Bible (esp. Matthew) is full of &#8220;fulfilled biblical prophecies,&#8221; but that&#8217;s kind of to be expected.<\/p>\n<p>I looked around at the CADC site for the basis for this assertion, but their &#8220;<a href=\"http:\/\/defendchristians.org\/resources\/\">Resources<\/a>&#8221; page is simply an introduction to &#8220;Seven Reasons Barack Obama Is Not A Christian.&#8221; \u00a0Um &#8230; right &#8230;<\/p>\n<blockquote><p>Atheists seem to hold a deep-seated, irrational resentment against Christmas and the joyous message of salvation that it declares. They are apparently too proud to admit their sin and need of a Savior, so they flee to \u201cREASON.\u201d Yet, their atheistic reasoning is so inconsistent and depressing.<\/p><\/blockquote>\n<p>Oh, those Atheists &#8212; so &#8220;deep-seated irrational,&#8221; so &#8220;proud&#8221; and &#8220;inconsistent&#8221; and &#8220;depressing.&#8221; \u00a0It&#8217;s a good thing the CADC can try to defend against the defamation of Christianity without defaming others, because otherwise those Atheists sure would be easy targets!<\/p>\n<p>Ahem. So we trot out the standard anti-Atheist memes here:<\/p>\n<ul>\n<li>Atheists are driven by a resentment\/hatred of God\/Christ and, by extension, Christmas. \u00a0The idea that one might legitimately, honestly question the facts of Christianity, or its theology (itself a tangled web that&#8217;s cause Christians to come to blows and blood and the auto-de-fe in the past), is utterly beyond comprehension.<\/li>\n<li>Atheists are just simply too proud to admit that they are sinful and in need of salvation. \u00a0Never mind that some Christians seem to proud over their having achieved salvation over those other poor schmucks who are headed to the Fiery Furnace.<\/li>\n<\/ul>\n<p><a href=\"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/atheist_hell.jpg\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"alignright size-medium wp-image-19371\" title=\"Atheist Hell\" src=\"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/atheist_hell-269x300.jpg\" alt=\"\" width=\"269\" height=\"300\" srcset=\"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/atheist_hell-269x300.jpg 269w, https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/atheist_hell-143x160.jpg 143w, https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/atheist_hell-67x75.jpg 67w, https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/atheist_hell.jpg 400w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 269px) 85vw, 269px\" \/><\/a>There&#8217;s nothing to base these idea on, other than wishful thinking. It&#8217;s as silly (or slanderous) to assert that atheists know in their heart that God exists and are simply ignoring Him out of fear or pride, as it is to assert that theists know (ahem) in their heart that God is a myth and are simply going along out of fear or pride.<\/p>\n<p>And, by the way, what is it about REASON that makes it something one &#8220;flees&#8221; to? \u00a0Sign me up with <a href=\"http:\/\/wist.info\/heschel-abraham\/11247\/\">Abraham Heschel<\/a>, a man of faith:<\/p>\n<blockquote><p><em>Without reason we would not know how to apply the insights of faith to the concrete issues of living. \u2026 The rejection of reason is cowardice and betrays a lack of faith.<\/em><\/p><\/blockquote>\n<p>The idea that God created us as Reasoning individuals says to me we are called on to use those cognitive tools that God provided us. I think there is room (at least in my life) for Faith as well as Reason &#8212; indeed, as with Heschel, I think both are critical components. \u00a0But to dismiss atheists as &#8220;fleeing to Reason&#8221; is to denegrate one of God&#8217;s great gifts to us.<\/p>\n<blockquote><p>I have always wondered why atheists spend money on billboards to try to persuade others of their position if they really believe their own ideology. According to honest atheists, if there is no God logic dictates there is no truth, right or wrong, or meaning.<\/p>\n<p>Yet some atheists are compelled to live as if what they think is true, and that their lives actually do matter. It looks to me like they didn\u2019t read their Nietzsche very closely and can\u2019t live according to \u201cREASON\u201d after all.<\/p><\/blockquote>\n<p><a href=\"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/bizarro_atheists.jpg\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"size-medium wp-image-19370 alignright\" title=\" Bizarro - atheists\" src=\"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/bizarro_atheists-251x300.jpg\" alt=\"\" width=\"251\" height=\"300\" srcset=\"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/bizarro_atheists-251x300.jpg 251w, https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/bizarro_atheists-134x160.jpg 134w, https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/bizarro_atheists-62x75.jpg 62w, https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/bizarro_atheists.jpg 396w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 251px) 85vw, 251px\" \/><\/a>The appeal to &#8220;honest atheists&#8221; aside, while it is true that some atheists are nihilist (just as some Christians are hate-mongers), and some think Nietzsche is the coolest philosopher ever (just as some Christians think Pat Robertson is da bomb), most of the ones I know do believe in &#8220;right and wrong,&#8221; do feel that life has &#8220;meaning&#8221; &#8212; but a meaning that they figure out for themselves, and right and wrong as they reason makes sense, as opposed to simply taking what a preacher or scripture or some other blessed authority dictates.<\/p>\n<p>I&#8217;m not sure what it means to say that &#8220;if there is no God, logic dictates there is no truth.&#8221; \u00a0I&#8217;d look for more education on the subject, but the Resources page is <em>still <\/em>blathering about Obama being an Evil, Liberal, Radical, False Christian.<\/p>\n<blockquote><p>As a Christian I understand it\u2019s impossible to make sense of this world and my life apart from God. Jesus Christ alone meets the deepest need of mankind- reconciliation to a Holy God.<\/p><\/blockquote>\n<p>As a Christian, I am glad you (whoever you are) find sense in this world and life as informed by Jesus Christ. \u00a0Your anecdotal evidence is hardly demonstrable truth, let along logic and reason, that nobody can can do similarly without Him. \u00a0There seem to be plenty of people in the world to demonstrate just the opposite, no matter how much you claim it is impossible.<\/p>\n<p>Some of them even seem to be (gasp) <em>atheists<\/em>.<\/p>\n<blockquote><p>Reason ultimately ends in hopelessness, meaninglessness and despair.<\/p><\/blockquote>\n<p>Because?<\/p>\n<blockquote>\n<figure id=\"attachment_19376\" aria-describedby=\"caption-attachment-19376\" style=\"width: 290px\" class=\"wp-caption alignright\"><a href=\"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/sinatra-haveyourself.jpg\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"size-medium wp-image-19376\" title=\"Frank Sinatra - Have Yourself a Merry Little Christmas\" src=\"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/sinatra-haveyourself-290x300.jpg\" alt=\"\" width=\"290\" height=\"300\" srcset=\"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/sinatra-haveyourself-290x300.jpg 290w, https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/sinatra-haveyourself-630x650.jpg 630w, https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/sinatra-haveyourself-155x160.jpg 155w, https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/sinatra-haveyourself-72x75.jpg 72w, https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/sinatra-haveyourself-484x500.jpg 484w, https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/sinatra-haveyourself.jpg 1241w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 290px) 85vw, 290px\" \/><\/a><figcaption id=\"caption-attachment-19376\" class=\"wp-caption-text\">The Christ Mass According to St. Frankie<\/figcaption><\/figure>\n<p>Atheists want us to replace \u201cHave Yourself a Merry Little Christmas\u201d with \u201cHave Yourself a Nihilistic Breakdown.\u201d<\/p><\/blockquote>\n<p>Oddly enough, I don&#8217;t know any atheists want anyone to have &#8220;Nihilistic Breakdowns.&#8221; \u00a0In fact, most of them would be happy for folks to have a &#8220;Merry Little Christmas&#8221; (If I noted that the song is utterly non-religious, other than using the word &#8220;Christmas,&#8221; would I be being provocative?).<\/p>\n<blockquote><p>That doesn\u2019t sound very attractive to me. I much prefer a living hope and the supernatural joy of Christ, thank you very much.<\/p><\/blockquote>\n<p>And more power to you. \u00a0But if you can&#8217;t do so without mocking and namecalling of those who feel differently &#8212; does that raise you much above the level of what you&#8217;re\u00a0criticizing\u00a0in others?<\/p>\n<p>This post would not be complete without looking at the comments. \u00a0As one might expect, most show all the fervor of the original poster but with half the REASONing. \u00a0For example:<\/p>\n<blockquote><p><em>We shouldn\u2019t be surprised that someone foolish enough to hate and disbelieve in God would go to all lengths to make others \u201ctwo-fold more a child of hell\u201d than themselves. They particularly hate Biblical Christianity because Jesus Christ is the one &amp; only way to eternal life.<\/em><\/p><\/blockquote>\n<p>If one <em>disbelieves<\/em> in God, why would one <em>hate <\/em>God? \u00a0The underlying accusation here is that atheists not only know that God is real (they actually believe in him), they&#8217;re going through the atheistic motions out of hatred of God, and to suck others into their hell-bound maw. \u00a0I.e., atheists aren&#8217;t just wrong or unenlightened or mistaken, they are intentionally evil.<\/p>\n<p>All I can say here is that this doesn&#8217;t match most of the atheists I know. \u00a0It&#8217;s altogether possible, even likely, that some avowed atheists are actually anti-theists &#8212; they believe in God, but they are, in fact, angry and rejecting of their concept of God because of something that&#8217;s happened in their life. \u00a0But most of the folks I know who are atheists have taken a bit more reasoned \u00a0approach to their beliefs (more reasoned than most Cultural Christians), and are a-theists primarily for a reason.<\/p>\n<blockquote><p><em>To me, atheist are a testimony to Christianity as they have to name God before they can deny Him.\u00a0They have just named what they deny.<\/em><\/p><\/blockquote>\n<p>God is a Magic Name, and if you say it three times, there&#8217;s a 2d100 percentile chance that He will appear &#8230;<\/p>\n<blockquote>\n<figure id=\"attachment_19377\" aria-describedby=\"caption-attachment-19377\" style=\"width: 300px\" class=\"wp-caption alignright\"><a href=\"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/ch090204-pascalswager.gif\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"size-medium wp-image-19377\" title=\"Calvin and Pascal's Wager\" src=\"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/ch090204-pascalswager-300x101.gif\" alt=\"\" width=\"300\" height=\"101\" srcset=\"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/ch090204-pascalswager-300x101.gif 300w, https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/ch090204-pascalswager-160x53.gif 160w, https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/ch090204-pascalswager-75x25.gif 75w, https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/ch090204-pascalswager-500x168.gif 500w, https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/ch090204-pascalswager.gif 600w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 300px) 85vw, 300px\" \/><\/a><figcaption id=\"caption-attachment-19377\" class=\"wp-caption-text\">Proof via the Gospel of St. Calvin<\/figcaption><\/figure><\/blockquote>\n<p>Ah, <a href=\"http:\/\/en.wikipedia.org\/wiki\/Pascal's_Wager\">Pascal&#8217;s Wager<\/a>. What a truly heart-felt, sincere, positive, loving reason to be a Christian. Or a Zoroastrian. \u00a0Or a Hindu. \u00a0Or SantaClausist. Or &#8230;<\/p>\n<blockquote><p><em>I continually marvel at just how angry, resentful and even downright hostile atheists will become toward people who are simply exercising their own free will and Constitutional rights to choose what they personally want to believe and follow, just as the atheists have done. If atheists sincerely believe that God, Heaven, Hell, eternity, etc. are all part of some impotent, superstitous myth, why do they care so much that some people might choose to believe in it, even total strangers they don\u2019t even know? That they protest so vehemently tells it all, I think, meaning they actually know the truth, mad as everything at even the slightest reminder. Trying so desperately to hide from the truth, visible, vocal Christians must be real nasty thorns.<\/em><\/p><\/blockquote>\n<p>Or, maybe, they get tired of Christians arguing that not only are they (Christians) right, but that they (Atheists) know it but are desperately trying to hide from the truth.<\/p>\n<p>Or, framed another way,\u00a0<em>If Christians sincerely believe that God, Heaven, Hell, eternity, etc. are all real and therefore they are themselves saved, why do they care so much that some people might choose to disbelieve it, even total strangers they don\u2019t even know? That they protest so vehemently tells it all, I think, meaning they actually know the truth, mad as everything at even the slightest reminder. Trying so desperately to hide from the truth, visible, vocal atheists must be real nasty thorns.<\/em><\/p>\n<p>(See <a href=\"http:\/\/www.biblegateway.com\/passage\/?search=Matthew%207:1-5&amp;version=KJV\">Matthew 7:1-5<\/a>)<\/p>\n<p>I will note that some of the commenters are actually reasonable, even suggesting that Atheists are ticked off, not at Christ, but at Christians.<\/p>\n<blockquote><p><em>It bothers me, and angers me when Christians act out on their own fears and hatred of non-Christians. If atheists want to challenge the existence of God, lets organize a civilized and publicized discussion about it. Other than that, I say we join the organization American Atheists in promoting the free exercise of religion for all people in this country. The great men of Christ who formed the foundation of this country respected and protected the rights of conscience for all people \u2013 we should recognize that the institutional church has not always done so.<\/em><\/p><\/blockquote>\n<p>Amen, brother.<\/p>\n<p>So, to summarize:<\/p>\n<ol>\n<li>I&#8217;m not thrilled with the billboard in question largely because it&#8217;s confrontational and asserts what people believe in their hearts &#8212; as obnoxiously as the old &#8220;there are no atheists in foxholes&#8221; canard &#8230;<\/li>\n<li><a href=\"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/08\/jesus-says.jpg\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"alignright size-medium wp-image-18315\" title=\"Jesus says, &quot;Don't be a dick!&quot;\" src=\"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/08\/jesus-says-300x179.jpg\" alt=\"Jesus says, &quot;Don't be a dick!&quot;\" width=\"300\" height=\"179\" srcset=\"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/08\/jesus-says-300x179.jpg 300w, https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/08\/jesus-says-160x95.jpg 160w, https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/08\/jesus-says-75x44.jpg 75w, https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/08\/jesus-says.jpg 352w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 300px) 85vw, 300px\" \/><\/a>&#8230; or, to turn to this particular CADC post, as obnoxiously as the &#8220;atheists hate God therefore they hate people who believe in God because they are too proud and cowardly and sinful to admit they themselves believe in God&#8221; calumny.<\/li>\n<li>If you can&#8217;t protect yourself from defamation without defaming others, then consider simply <a href=\"http:\/\/www.biblegateway.com\/passage\/?search=Matthew+5:38-40&amp;version=NIV\">turning \u00a0the other cheek<\/a>. \u00a0It&#8217;s not easy, and it&#8217;s not something I, for one, do nearly as well as I ought, but, <em>especially <\/em>for those who claim to follow Christ, <em>it&#8217;s what we&#8217;re supposed to do, <\/em>dagnabbit.<\/li>\n<\/ol>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>So after discussing the Evils of Atheistic Billboards yesterday (or, more properly, the hypocrisy of Christians condemning Atheists for proselytization efforts), a few more items bobbed up on the subject. \u00a0Like this billboard: It came up at this page at Pharyngula in conjunction with PZ Myers objecting to an atheist with Christian family \u00a0members who &hellip; <a href=\"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2010\/12\/01\/discarding-reason-for-the-season.html\" class=\"more-link\">Continue reading<span class=\"screen-reader-text\"> &#8220;Discarding Reason for the Season&#8221;<\/span><\/a><\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":2,"featured_media":19383,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"_seopress_titles_title":"","_seopress_titles_desc":"","_seopress_robots_index":"","_seopress_robots_follow":"","_seopress_robots_imageindex":"","_seopress_robots_snippet":"","_seopress_robots_primary_cat":"","_seopress_robots_breadcrumbs":"","_seopress_robots_freeze_modified_date":"","_seopress_robots_custom_modified_date":"","_seopress_robots_canonical":"","_seopress_social_fb_title":"","_seopress_social_fb_desc":"","_seopress_social_fb_img":"","_seopress_social_fb_img_attachment_id":0,"_seopress_social_fb_img_width":0,"_seopress_social_fb_img_height":0,"_seopress_social_twitter_title":"","_seopress_social_twitter_desc":"","_seopress_social_twitter_img":"","_seopress_social_twitter_img_attachment_id":0,"_seopress_social_twitter_img_width":0,"_seopress_social_twitter_img_height":0,"_seopress_redirections_value":"","_seopress_redirections_enabled":"","_seopress_redirections_enabled_regex":"","_seopress_redirections_logged_status":"","_seopress_redirections_param":"","_seopress_redirections_type":0,"_seopress_analysis_target_kw":"","_jetpack_memberships_contains_paid_content":false,"footnotes":"","jetpack_publicize_message":"","jetpack_publicize_feature_enabled":true,"jetpack_social_post_already_shared":false,"jetpack_social_options":{"image_generator_settings":{"template":"highway","default_image_id":0,"font":"","enabled":false},"version":2}},"categories":[68,27,71,8],"tags":[],"class_list":["post-19368","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-holidays","category-religion","category-religion-me","category-zt-pc"],"jetpack_publicize_connections":[],"jetpack_featured_media_url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2010\/12\/tongues-sticking-out.jpg","jetpack_sharing_enabled":true,"jetpack-related-posts":[{"id":5515,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2004\/02\/27\/hue_cry_part_ii.html","url_meta":{"origin":19368,"position":0},"title":"Hue &#038; Cry, Part II","author":"***Dave","date":"Fri 27-Feb-04 5:27pm","format":false,"excerpt":"Missouri Republicans are up in arms after a media company backed out of a deal for a billboard along I-70 in St Louis' predominently white suburbs. The billboard showed a...","rel":"","context":"In &quot;Politics &amp; Law&quot;","block_context":{"text":"Politics &amp; Law","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/politics-law"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":3138,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2002\/08\/05\/winston_smith_m.html","url_meta":{"origin":19368,"position":1},"title":"Winston Smith, Moviemaker","author":"***Dave","date":"Mon 5-Aug-02 2:26pm","format":false,"excerpt":"A judge has upheld Sony's rights to digitally alter buildings and billboards in its movies. Some folks (billboard owners, in fact) had sued Sony because the company had superimposed its...","rel":"","context":"In &quot;Media Moguls&quot;","block_context":{"text":"Media Moguls","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/media\/media-moguls"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":10276,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2007\/02\/28\/what_were_they_thinking.html","url_meta":{"origin":19368,"position":2},"title":"What were they thinking?","author":"***Dave","date":"Wed 28-Feb-07 10:48am","format":false,"excerpt":"Jeez, people -- if you're going to design an anti-graffiti billboard, make sure you don't, y'know, leave a ton of white space on it. Otherwise ... (via BoingBoing)...","rel":"","context":"In &quot;Potpourri&quot;","block_context":{"text":"Potpourri","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/potpourri"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/www.hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/images\/graffiti.jpg?resize=350%2C200&ssl=1","width":350,"height":200},"classes":[]},{"id":137974,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2019\/02\/26\/a-particular-welcome-to-colorado.html","url_meta":{"origin":19368,"position":3},"title":"A particular welcome to Colorado","author":"***Dave","date":"Tue 26-Feb-19 8:01pm","format":false,"excerpt":"There's a new billboard along I-70 near the Utah-Colorado border. The billboard was paid for by ProgressNow Colorado as part of their Keep Abortion Safe project, and is addressed to the not-insubstantial number of Utah women crossing the state border for abortion services that are not readily available in their\u2026","rel":"","context":"In &quot;Church &amp; State&quot;","block_context":{"text":"Church &amp; State","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/politics-law\/church-state"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/02\/colorado-abortion-billboard.jpg?resize=350%2C200&ssl=1","width":350,"height":200,"srcset":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/02\/colorado-abortion-billboard.jpg?resize=350%2C200&ssl=1 1x, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/02\/colorado-abortion-billboard.jpg?resize=525%2C300&ssl=1 1.5x, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/02\/colorado-abortion-billboard.jpg?resize=700%2C400&ssl=1 2x, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/02\/colorado-abortion-billboard.jpg?resize=1050%2C600&ssl=1 3x, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/02\/colorado-abortion-billboard.jpg?resize=1400%2C800&ssl=1 4x"},"classes":[]},{"id":37,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2003\/07\/09\/terror.html","url_meta":{"origin":19368,"position":4},"title":"Terror","author":"***Dave","date":"Wed 9-Jul-03 8:48am","format":false,"excerpt":"For those who are reluctant to label Hezbollah -- the Syrian\/Iranian-backed group that autonomously runs the southern end of Lebannon and delights in, among other things, kidnapping, sniping, and shooting...","rel":"","context":"In &quot;Geopolitical Brouhaha&quot;","block_context":{"text":"Geopolitical Brouhaha","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/geopolitical-brouhaha"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":3322,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2002\/12\/19\/screed_2.html","url_meta":{"origin":19368,"position":5},"title":"Screed","author":"***Dave","date":"Thu 19-Dec-02 7:35am","format":false,"excerpt":"It's one thing to object on principle to a national celebration around a religious holiday (Christmas). Or, conversely, to complain about how Christmas has become so secularlized. It takes a...","rel":"","context":"In &quot;Religion&quot;","block_context":{"text":"Religion","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/religion"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]}],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/19368","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/2"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=19368"}],"version-history":[{"count":0,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/19368\/revisions"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/19383"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=19368"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=19368"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=19368"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}