{"id":23006,"date":"2011-10-08T13:26:05","date_gmt":"2011-10-08T19:26:05","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/?p=23006"},"modified":"2011-10-08T13:26:05","modified_gmt":"2011-10-08T19:26:05","slug":"romney-offers-weak-tea-objection-to-fischer-fischer-calls-it-leftist-insult","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2011\/10\/08\/romney-offers-weak-tea-objection-to-fischer-fischer-calls-it-leftist-insult.html","title":{"rendered":"Romney offers weak tea objection to Fischer; Fischer calls it leftist insult"},"content":{"rendered":"
\"\"<\/a>
Mitt Romney, Not-Really-Christian Insulter of Values Voters<\/figcaption><\/figure>\n

There’s been a fair amount of discussion and expectation about how Mitt Romney, a speaker at the “Values Voters Summit” (cough), would react to being the person on stage immediately before Bryan Fischer (my pet dolt). \u00a0Fischer has, of course, been a regular critic of the Mormon Church, declaring it non-Christian and therefore not (in his worldview askew) protected by the first Amendment<\/a>.<\/p>\n

It’s an argument that we’re hearing from multiple quarters on the Christianist Right — Dave Barton<\/a>, pseudo-historian, and some of Rick Perry’s more fringy evangelical supporters. \u00a0Mormons aren’t Christians, Mormons are a cult, Mormons don’t deserve religious freedom if they step 0ut of line. \u00a0And, of course, you can’t risk one of those untrustworthy, cultish, un-True-American\u2122\u00a0in the White House …<\/p>\n

So people were wondering<\/a> how Mitt would react to this. \u00a0Of course, he was willing in the first place to appear at a convention where all the above sorts were preaching their peculiar brand of American Exceptionalism (“We’re all Americans except <\/em>those gays \/ Muslims \/ liberals \/ atheists \/ feminists \/ illegal aliens \/ Mormons \/ ACLU types …”). \u00a0Sure, he wants to be president, so he needs to pander to Rick Perry’s zany base, but …<\/p>\n

… but would he dare say anything as he passed the mic on to Bryan “You Mormons are a bunch of polygamists at heart” Fischer? \u00a0Would he?<\/p>\n

Well … kind of, he did<\/a>. During his address, he said:<\/p>\n

Almost all Americans live for a purpose greater than ourselves.\u00a0 Our heritage of religious faith and tolerance has importantly shaped who we have become as a people.\u00a0 We must continue to welcome faith into the public square and allow it to flourish. Our government should respect religious values, not silence them. We will always pledge our allegiance to a nation under God.<\/p>\n

Our values ennoble the citizen, and they strengthen the nation. We should remember that decency and civility are values too. One of the speakers who will follow me today, has crossed that line I think. Poisonous language does not advance our cause. It has never softened a single heart nor changed a single mind. The blessings of faith carry the responsibility of civil and respectful debate. The task before us is to focus on the conservative beliefs and the values that unite us \u2013 let no agenda, narrow our vision or drive us apart.<\/p><\/blockquote>\n

Not bad. \u00a0A nice little blurb. \u00a0Of course, he didn’t actually address Fischer by name. He didn’t actually identify the uncivil, indecent, poisonous language he was referring to. \u00a0He didn’t mention his faith by name … and he got fairly “tepid” applause for his efforts.<\/p>\n

\"\"<\/a>
Bryan Fischer, Dolt<\/figcaption><\/figure>\n

That’s okay. \u00a0Even if Romney was unwilling to actually connect the dots, his indirect target was more than happy to engage. \u00a0When Bryan Fischer was asked about Romney’s speech, he replied<\/a>:<\/p>\n

I thought it was tasteless. I thought he was allowing the New York Times and the Southern Poverty Law Center and People for the American Way to dictate the content of his speech, which I think was a mistake for him to do at the Values Voters Summit. That was kind of an insult to the people in the room. … \u00a0I don\u2019t think it helped him.<\/p><\/blockquote>\n

Because, apparently, calls to civility and decency are the sigh of the NY Times, the SPLC, and PFAW. \u00a0Real True American Christians\u2122\u00a0aren’t civil or decent. \u00a0At least that’s what Fischer thinks, and assumes “the people in the room” feel the same way.<\/p>\n

When pressed, Fischer wouldn’t actually come out and say that Mormons were a “cult” or disqualified for the presidency. \u00a0He just kept repeating that the LDS church was “outside the mainstream of historic Christian orthodoxy” — which response should be kept in context of his repeated statements during his own VVS speech that any US president must be “a man of sincere, authentic, genuine Christian faith”).<\/p>\n

(For more on Fischer’s speech — where he lambasted all the usual targets — see here<\/a>.)<\/p>\n

I do give some credit to Romney. \u00a0There’s nothing particularly wrong with arguing for civility and speech. \u00a0I think expression of religious values in life is good and valuable (though, just like expression of any other values, they don’t immunize the person or those vales from criticism). \u00a0He through in the Public Square and Under God bits, which (like so much of what Romney says) is difficult to interpret as heartfelt sentiment or opportunistic pandering.<\/p>\n

But, honestly and bottom line, he seems to have been the only one at the VVS who was willing to stand up to the litany of hate and “Us against Them \/ Good vs Evil” which was both Fischer’s speech and the speech of so many others at the VVS. \u00a0Rather than upping the rhetorical \u00a0ante by throwing more bloody red meat to the crowd, he offered … well, maybe a neatly trimmed, but somewhat dry, chicken breast.<\/p>\n

\"\"<\/a>Fischer on the other hand, demonstrates that the wingnutty Right are unwilling to listen to such appeals for moderation and respect. \u00a0That kind of talk is an “insult,” just what one would expect from the liberal media, the groups willing to identify others for hate speech, and the groups looking to protect religious freedom for all.<\/p>\n

Which tells you a lot about Fischer and the VVS. \u00a0As does the fact that Romney felt he had to go speak there in the first place, in order to win the GOP nomination.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"

There’s been a fair amount of discussion and expectation about how Mitt Romney, a speaker at the “Values Voters Summit” (cough), would react to being the person on stage immediately before Bryan Fischer (my pet dolt). \u00a0Fischer has, of course, been a regular critic of the Mormon Church, declaring it non-Christian and therefore not (in … Continue reading “Romney offers weak tea objection to Fischer; Fischer calls it leftist insult”<\/span><\/a><\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":2,"featured_media":23007,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"_seopress_robots_primary_cat":"","_seopress_titles_title":"","_seopress_titles_desc":"","_seopress_robots_index":"","_seopress_analysis_target_kw":"","_jetpack_memberships_contains_paid_content":false,"footnotes":"","jetpack_publicize_message":"","jetpack_publicize_feature_enabled":true,"jetpack_social_post_already_shared":false,"jetpack_social_options":{"image_generator_settings":{"template":"highway","default_image_id":0,"font":"","enabled":false},"version":2}},"categories":[100,99],"tags":[],"class_list":["post-23006","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-dolts","category-elections-2012"],"jetpack_publicize_connections":[],"jetpack_featured_media_url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2011\/10\/ValuesVoters.jpg","jetpack_sharing_enabled":true,"jetpack-related-posts":[{"id":27355,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2012\/04\/11\/the-arch-right-vs-the-mormon.html","url_meta":{"origin":23006,"position":0},"title":"The Arch-Right vs the Mormon","author":"***Dave","date":"Wed 11-Apr-12 2:56pm","format":false,"excerpt":"Bryan Fischer, famous dolt, suggests that True Christians(TM) won't vote for Romney because Romney, a Mormon, is a \"spiritually compromised\" \"polytheist,\" a \"non-Christian.\"On the one hand, as a non-fan of Mitt for a variety of reasons (none of which include the above), I am pleased at any predictions that the\u2026","rel":"","context":"In "~PlusPosts"","block_context":{"text":"~PlusPosts","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/blogging\/plusposts"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":30799,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2012\/10\/23\/its-almost-worth-it-just-to-see-bryan-fischer-have-a-conniption.html","url_meta":{"origin":23006,"position":1},"title":"It's almost worth it just to see Bryan Fischer have a conniption","author":"***Dave","date":"Tue 23-Oct-12 9:24pm","format":false,"excerpt":"Of course, Fischer has resisted Romney as a candidate tooth and claw, being staunchly anti-Mormon (including them in the group of non-Christian religions that only get to freely practice because of true Christians granting them the privilege, not because they are covered under the First Amendment, which Fischer says only\u2026","rel":"","context":"In "~PlusPosts"","block_context":{"text":"~PlusPosts","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/blogging\/plusposts"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":27730,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2012\/05\/03\/wherein-bryan-fischer-actually-says-something-i-agree-with.html","url_meta":{"origin":23006,"position":2},"title":"Wherein Bryan Fischer actually says something I agree with","author":"***Dave","date":"Thu 3-May-12 11:21am","format":false,"excerpt":"Bryan Fischer, dolt, is cackling like mad for having \"led\" the fight that brought about the resignation of Mitt Romney's foreign affairs \/ national security campaign advisor and spokesman, Richard Grenell. Who, it turns out, had the bad taste to be gay and, despite stellar neo-conservative cred, was thus unacceptable\u2026","rel":"","context":"In "~PlusPosts"","block_context":{"text":"~PlusPosts","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/blogging\/plusposts"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":23806,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2011\/11\/16\/god-is-my-co-pilot-jesus-is-my-secretary-of-defense.html","url_meta":{"origin":23006,"position":3},"title":"God is my co-pilot, Jesus is my Secretary of Defense","author":"***Dave","date":"Wed 16-Nov-11 11:57pm","format":false,"excerpt":"I am really curious to see -- if, as Bryan Fischer (dolt) claims, the Command-in-Chief absolutely must be a Christian, and not a Mormon (sic) or Muslim -- how he'll react to a Romney\/Obama presidential race. #ddtb Embedded Link Fischer: Our Commander-In-Chief Must Be A Christian Earlier this year, Bryan\u2026","rel":"","context":"In "~PlusPosts"","block_context":{"text":"~PlusPosts","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/blogging\/plusposts"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":23082,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2011\/10\/14\/unblogged-bits-fri-14-oct-11-1730.html","url_meta":{"origin":23006,"position":4},"title":"Unblogged Bits (Fri. 14-Oct-11 1730)","author":"***Dave","date":"Fri 14-Oct-11 5:30pm","format":false,"excerpt":"Links (most recent first) that caught my eye, but did not warrant full-blown blog entries .... Federal Appeals Court Blocks Alabama Assault On Immigrant School Children - Good. House Passes Toxic Coal Ash Bill - \"Toxic\" describes most of the bills the GOP House passes. Fischer: Fornication And Homosexuality Should\u2026","rel":"","context":"In "Potpourri"","block_context":{"text":"Potpourri","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/potpourri"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":31269,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2012\/11\/07\/viewed-askewed.html","url_meta":{"origin":23006,"position":5},"title":"Viewed Askewed","author":"***Dave","date":"Wed 7-Nov-12 11:23am","format":false,"excerpt":"The \"Unskewed Polls\" site, led by Dean Chambers, was clung to desperately by a number of GOP partisans, and was a keystone of the arguments by folks like George Will and Donald Trump and Bryan Fischer that Romney would win in a landslide of 300 ECV or more.Granted, there was\u2026","rel":"","context":"In "~PlusPosts"","block_context":{"text":"~PlusPosts","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/blogging\/plusposts"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]}],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/23006","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/2"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=23006"}],"version-history":[{"count":0,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/23006\/revisions"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/23007"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=23006"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=23006"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=23006"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}