{"id":42479,"date":"2014-06-10T14:35:01","date_gmt":"2014-06-10T20:35:01","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2014\/06\/10\/jane-we-cant-stop-this-crazy-thing.html"},"modified":"2014-06-10T16:06:00","modified_gmt":"2014-06-10T22:06:00","slug":"jane-we-cant-stop-this-crazy-thing","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2014\/06\/10\/jane-we-cant-stop-this-crazy-thing.html","title":{"rendered":"Jane! We Can't Stop This Crazy Thing!"},"content":{"rendered":"
The NSA is being sued in Jewel v. NSA<\/i> that it collects information\u00a0about Americans' telephone and Internet activities (in particular, for standing, a set of individuals has filed the suit, supported by the EFF). It's been ordered by the courts to preserve any data to help demonstrate (or disprove) that such illegal collection is going on.<\/p>\n

Now the NSA is claiming that the amount of data is so huge, and distributed in such a complex fashion between systems, that it cannot retain for discovery the data in question because its computers would burst into flames and sparks would shoot across the room (to use an old SF trope). The only alternative would be to shut down all<\/i> such surveillance activity, which would mean, of course, the terrorists win.<\/p>\n

It's either a wildly convenient excuse ("the dog had to eat my homework") or a sign that the NSA is sucking in waaaaaay too much data for it to manage effectively. \u00a0Or, of course, both. \u00a0<\/p>\n

As someone whose auto-archive\/purge was turned on of his email for several months because of company legal matter discovery, and whose system slowed to a crawl because of the size of the message store … I should have a lot more sympathy for the NSA than I do. But if they'd be willing to posit that, yes, the plaintiff's data was, in fact, part of the data that has since been deleted, I'm sure everyone would be satisfied …<\/p>\n

Reshared post from +Andreas Schou<\/a><\/strong><\/p>\n

That's a fascinating defense: the NSA is arguing, too late, that the taps operated pursuant to Section 702 are so complex that they cannot shut down the deletion cycle.\u00a0<\/p>\n

This is almost certainly not the case. The more likely reason is that they are operating a several-day buffer of all communications traffic over the lines they monitor, and the intake rate would choke their storage if they tried to retain the data for any longer. At a rate of (say) tens of petabytes per day, they couldn't even write the data they're storing to tape: the data transfer rate to tape would almost certainly bottleneck.<\/p>\n

"But we would have to shut down the taps because we're collecting all American communications traffic!" is not a particularly compelling whine. If they are collecting all American communications traffic, then what they are doing is almost certainly unconstitutional, and they should shut it down for that reason instead.\ufeff<\/p><\/blockquote>\n<\/div>\n

\n

\n \n <\/div>\n

NSA: Our systems are so complex we can\u2019t stop them from deleting data wanted for lawsuit<\/a>
\n The latest from the Electronic Frontier Foundation’s Jewel v. NSA suit. \n <\/p>\n

View this post on Google+<\/a><\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"

The NSA is being sued in Jewel v. NSA that it collects information\u00a0about Americans' telephone and Internet activities (in particular, for standing, a set of individuals has filed the suit, supported by the EFF). It's been ordered by the courts to preserve any data to help demonstrate (or disprove) that such illegal collection is going … Continue reading “Jane! We Can't Stop This Crazy Thing!”<\/span><\/a><\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":2,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"_seopress_titles_title":"","_seopress_titles_desc":"","_seopress_robots_index":"","_seopress_robots_follow":"","_seopress_robots_imageindex":"","_seopress_robots_snippet":"","_seopress_robots_primary_cat":"","_seopress_robots_breadcrumbs":"","_seopress_robots_freeze_modified_date":"","_seopress_robots_custom_modified_date":"","_seopress_robots_canonical":"","_seopress_social_fb_title":"","_seopress_social_fb_desc":"","_seopress_social_fb_img":"","_seopress_social_fb_img_attachment_id":0,"_seopress_social_fb_img_width":0,"_seopress_social_fb_img_height":0,"_seopress_social_twitter_title":"","_seopress_social_twitter_desc":"","_seopress_social_twitter_img":"","_seopress_social_twitter_img_attachment_id":0,"_seopress_social_twitter_img_width":0,"_seopress_social_twitter_img_height":0,"_seopress_redirections_value":"","_seopress_redirections_enabled":"","_seopress_redirections_enabled_regex":"","_seopress_redirections_logged_status":"","_seopress_redirections_param":"","_seopress_redirections_type":0,"_seopress_analysis_target_kw":"","_jetpack_memberships_contains_paid_content":false,"footnotes":"","jetpack_publicize_message":"","jetpack_publicize_feature_enabled":true,"jetpack_social_post_already_shared":true,"jetpack_social_options":{"image_generator_settings":{"template":"highway","default_image_id":0,"font":"","enabled":false},"version":2}},"categories":[106,17,132],"tags":[586],"class_list":["post-42479","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","hentry","category-plusposts","category-homeland-security","category-privacy","tag-pluspost"],"jetpack_publicize_connections":[],"jetpack_featured_media_url":"","jetpack_sharing_enabled":true,"jetpack-related-posts":[{"id":50530,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2015\/05\/07\/so-maybe-now-we-can-have-a-debate-about-nsa-data-collection.html","url_meta":{"origin":42479,"position":0},"title":"So maybe now we can have a debate about NSA data collection","author":"***Dave","date":"Thu 7-May-15 10:31am","format":false,"excerpt":"A federal appellate court has ruled that the NSA's interpretation of the PATRIOT Act \u00a7215 is incorrect, and it can't vacuum up the metadatda for every phone call in the US willy-nilly.Now, I have little doubt that if the NSA goes back to Congress and asks them, when PATRIOT is\u2026","rel":"","context":"In "~PlusPosts"","block_context":{"text":"~PlusPosts","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/blogging\/plusposts"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":128044,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2015\/09\/17\/whats-good-for-the-nsa-is-good-for-the-chinese.html","url_meta":{"origin":42479,"position":1},"title":"What's good for the NSA is good for the Chinese","author":"***Dave","date":"Thu 17-Sep-15 10:01pm","format":false,"excerpt":"Is anyone surprised that the Chinese want as much back-door access to systems and data and cryptographic systems as, say, the NSA and US intelligence agencies do?And aside from \"Well, we're the good guys and they're the bad guys,\" how can you argue with that? Especially given the size of\u2026","rel":"","context":"In "~PlusPosts"","block_context":{"text":"~PlusPosts","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/blogging\/plusposts"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":51349,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2015\/06\/03\/as-usual-the-onion-hits-disturbingly-close-to-home-nsa-edition.html","url_meta":{"origin":42479,"position":2},"title":"As usual, "The Onion" hits disturbingly close to home (NSA Edition)","author":"***Dave","date":"Wed 3-Jun-15 6:05am","format":false,"excerpt":"It's times like these that I want to Fast-Forward 50 years hence and see what's happened (and what was actually happening). Frustrated NSA Now Forced To Rely On Mass Surveillance Programs That Haven\u2019t Come To Light Yet FORT MEADE, MD\u2014Expressing frustration over Congress\u2019 decision to let the provisions allowing the\u2026","rel":"","context":"In "~PlusPosts"","block_context":{"text":"~PlusPosts","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/blogging\/plusposts"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":38882,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2013\/09\/29\/the-money-question-about-the-nsa.html","url_meta":{"origin":42479,"position":3},"title":"The Money Question about the NSA","author":"***Dave","date":"Sun 29-Sep-13 10:27am","format":false,"excerpt":"\"But they're the good guys, right?\"Short answer: Even if what they are doing right now is good, they're opening the door (literally as well as figuratively) for the bad guys, foreign and domestic, to do bad stuff.Reshared post from +Kee Hinckley\u275d The NSA mission is national security. How is the\u2026","rel":"","context":"In "~PlusPosts"","block_context":{"text":"~PlusPosts","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/blogging\/plusposts"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":37778,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2013\/06\/11\/never-mind-the-privacy-implications-those-slides-are-awful.html","url_meta":{"origin":42479,"position":4},"title":"Never mind the privacy implications, those slides are AWFUL!","author":"***Dave","date":"Tue 11-Jun-13 6:58pm","format":false,"excerpt":"I have no idea why government agencies make such crappy PowerPoint decks. \u00a0Fortunately, someone's got the NSA's back ...Reshared post from +Jeff JarvisA designer does the NSA the favor of remaking its PowerPoint slides.... Dear NSA, let me take care of your slides. Dear NSA, you can do whatever with\u2026","rel":"","context":"In "~PlusPosts"","block_context":{"text":"~PlusPosts","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/blogging\/plusposts"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":39622,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2013\/11\/08\/google-vs-nsa-round-2.html","url_meta":{"origin":42479,"position":5},"title":"Google vs. NSA, Round 2","author":"***Dave","date":"Fri 8-Nov-13 12:05pm","format":false,"excerpt":"If the NSA were revealed to be tapping into the Koch Brothers business operation networks, I suspect we'd see a lot more outrage on Capitol Hill.Reshared post from +Les JenkinsI'm happy to see both Google not just sitting idly by while their internal traffic is intercepted by the government. I\u2026","rel":"","context":"In "~PlusPosts"","block_context":{"text":"~PlusPosts","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/blogging\/plusposts"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]}],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/42479","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/2"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=42479"}],"version-history":[{"count":1,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/42479\/revisions"}],"predecessor-version":[{"id":42481,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/42479\/revisions\/42481"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=42479"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=42479"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=42479"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}