{"id":4774,"date":"2004-01-08T08:25:21","date_gmt":"2004-01-08T15:25:21","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/?p=4774"},"modified":"2004-01-08T08:25:21","modified_gmt":"2004-01-08T15:25:21","slug":"government_reli","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2004\/01\/08\/government_reli.html","title":{"rendered":"Government, religion, and … flags?"},"content":{"rendered":"

\"Mississippi\"The US Supreme Court is considering hearing a case against the Mississippi state flag<\/a>, which contains the Confederate battle emblem. Unlike most such suits against Confederate symbols, though, the suit is being brought by a Muslim, claiming that the flag is a religious symbol<\/a>, based on the St Andrew’s Cross (like the Scottish national flag), and thus violates the Constitutional boundary between church and state.<\/p>\n

While that argument seems to rest on dubious historic grounds (the designer of the Confederate battle emblem never referred to St Andrew’s cross in its description), there are other states where the connection is far clearer. The Hawaiian state flag<\/a>, for example, has a Union Jack<\/a> in the corner — a combination of the crosses of St George, St Andrew, and St Patrick (a triple threat!), and thus much more clearly of religious origin.<\/p>\n

But, I mean, yeesh, guys. While it’s sometimes way too easy for folks to slip particularly obvious religion into governmental workings under the guise of “historical and cultural heritage,” this is a case of that being a legitimate excuse if ever there was one. I suspect that that not one in ten thousand Americans realizes the original religious symbolism of the Union Jack, for example — the union of the banners of the patron saints of the three countries involved. It’s hard to argue prejudice when we’re talking ignorance, instead. <\/p>\n

It’s even worse with the Mississippi case, since I would argue that virtually nobody looks at the Confederate battle emblem and says, “Hey! Christian symbology!”<\/p>\n

Except, it seems, the person bringing the suit.<\/p>\n

Heck, Maryland <\/a>would be a more obvious target, half of its flag containing clear crosses (the arms of the Crossland family). The official flags descriptions of New Jersey <\/a>and New York <\/a>both refer to the “goddesses.” And let’s not talk about how eagles, bears, stags, and even stars and, ahem, crescent moons have been used as religious symbols, and feature prominently on various state flags.<\/p>\n

Yeesh.<\/p>\n

(via Technoptimist<\/a>)<\/small><\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"

The US Supreme Court is considering hearing a case against the Mississippi state flag, which contains the Confederate battle emblem. Unlike most such suits against Confederate symbols, though, the suit…<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":2,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"_seopress_titles_title":"","_seopress_titles_desc":"","_seopress_robots_index":"","_seopress_robots_follow":"","_seopress_robots_imageindex":"","_seopress_robots_snippet":"","_seopress_robots_primary_cat":"","_seopress_robots_breadcrumbs":"","_seopress_robots_freeze_modified_date":"","_seopress_robots_custom_modified_date":"","_seopress_robots_canonical":"","_seopress_social_fb_title":"","_seopress_social_fb_desc":"","_seopress_social_fb_img":"","_seopress_social_fb_img_attachment_id":0,"_seopress_social_fb_img_width":0,"_seopress_social_fb_img_height":0,"_seopress_social_twitter_title":"","_seopress_social_twitter_desc":"","_seopress_social_twitter_img":"","_seopress_social_twitter_img_attachment_id":0,"_seopress_social_twitter_img_width":0,"_seopress_social_twitter_img_height":0,"_seopress_redirections_value":"","_seopress_redirections_enabled":"","_seopress_redirections_enabled_regex":"","_seopress_redirections_logged_status":"","_seopress_redirections_param":"","_seopress_redirections_type":0,"_seopress_analysis_target_kw":"","_jetpack_memberships_contains_paid_content":false,"footnotes":"","jetpack_publicize_message":"","jetpack_publicize_feature_enabled":true,"jetpack_social_post_already_shared":false,"jetpack_social_options":{"image_generator_settings":{"template":"highway","default_image_id":0,"font":"","enabled":false},"version":2}},"categories":[8],"tags":[],"class_list":["post-4774","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","hentry","category-zt-pc"],"jetpack_publicize_connections":[],"jetpack_featured_media_url":"","jetpack_sharing_enabled":true,"jetpack-related-posts":[{"id":135851,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2018\/01\/14\/confederate-flag-compromise-isnt.html","url_meta":{"origin":4774,"position":0},"title":"A confederate flag compromise that isn’t","author":"***Dave","date":"Sun 14-Jan-18 9:33am","format":false,"excerpt":"I'd love to know whether GOP state rep Greg Snowden is being naive or nefarious in proposing a solution to the debate in Mississippi over continued use of the Confederate battle ensign in its state flag that will likely only satisfy the folk who want to keep that tribute to\u2026","rel":"","context":"In "~PlusPosts"","block_context":{"text":"~PlusPosts","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/blogging\/plusposts"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2018\/01\/unnamed-2.jpg?resize=350%2C200&ssl=1","width":350,"height":200},"classes":[]},{"id":51609,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2015\/06\/24\/is-the-american-flag-next.html","url_meta":{"origin":4774,"position":1},"title":""Is the American flag next?"","author":"***Dave","date":"Wed 24-Jun-15 2:04pm","format":false,"excerpt":"Um ... no. That seems unlikely. Unlike the Confederate battle flag, the American flag is, actually, our national flag.Mind you, Americans have a fetish about the stars and stripes that could probably bear with some moderation. But there's a significant difference between the social ostracizing of the battle flag of\u2026","rel":"","context":"In "~PlusPosts"","block_context":{"text":"~PlusPosts","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/blogging\/plusposts"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":51704,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2015\/07\/08\/a-confederate-flag-ban-too-far-i-think.html","url_meta":{"origin":4774,"position":2},"title":"A Confederate flag ban too far, I think","author":"***Dave","date":"Wed 8-Jul-15 5:09pm","format":false,"excerpt":"I'm hardly a fan of the Confederate battle flag, the country it represented, or the cause of slavery behind it. But if fallen CSA soldiers are interred in federal war cemeteries, then a once-a-year, family-driven, one-day display of the Confederate battle flag on their graves seems historically appropriate to me.\u2026","rel":"","context":"In "~PlusPosts"","block_context":{"text":"~PlusPosts","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/blogging\/plusposts"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":51524,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2015\/06\/19\/lindsey-graham-thinks-the-confederate-battle-flag-works-for-south-carolina.html","url_meta":{"origin":4774,"position":3},"title":"Lindsey Graham thinks the Confederate battle flag "works" for South Carolina","author":"***Dave","date":"Fri 19-Jun-15 4:33pm","format":false,"excerpt":"\"The flag represents to some people a civil war and that was the symbol of one side. To others, it's a racist symbol, and it has been used in a racist way.\"And ... neither of those fazes you, Sen. Graham? That the side that lost the civil war against the\u2026","rel":"","context":"In "~PlusPosts"","block_context":{"text":"~PlusPosts","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/blogging\/plusposts"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":51759,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2015\/07\/16\/waving-the-confederate-flag.html","url_meta":{"origin":4774,"position":4},"title":"Waving the Confederate flag","author":"***Dave","date":"Thu 16-Jul-15 4:14pm","format":false,"excerpt":"As part of the crowd greeting President Obama in Oklahoma City, we got this particular band of flag-wavers:http:\/\/www.motherjones.com\/mojo\/2015\/07\/obama-greeted-by-confederate-flags-oklahoma-cityActually, this demonstrates a good thing: the Confederate Battle Flag may be getting kicked off of official government displays, but the First Amendment means that individuals can still wave it around to reveal\u2026","rel":"","context":"In "~PlusPosts"","block_context":{"text":"~PlusPosts","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/blogging\/plusposts"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2015\/07\/CKAQt4GW8AQ0sWj5B15D.jpgimgmax%3D660.jpg?resize=350%2C200&ssl=1","width":350,"height":200,"srcset":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2015\/07\/CKAQt4GW8AQ0sWj5B15D.jpgimgmax%3D660.jpg?resize=350%2C200&ssl=1 1x, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2015\/07\/CKAQt4GW8AQ0sWj5B15D.jpgimgmax%3D660.jpg?resize=525%2C300&ssl=1 1.5x"},"classes":[]},{"id":51527,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2015\/06\/20\/flags-2.html","url_meta":{"origin":4774,"position":5},"title":"Flags","author":"***Dave","date":"Sat 20-Jun-15 12:10pm","format":false,"excerpt":"Ironic that Flag Day was less than a week ago, here in the US ...In the wake of the Charleston killings, a lot of people pointed at the proud location of a Confederate battle flag on the statehouse grounds, noting it as a symbol of a civil war fought to\u2026","rel":"","context":"In "~PlusPosts"","block_context":{"text":"~PlusPosts","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/blogging\/plusposts"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]}],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/4774","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/2"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=4774"}],"version-history":[{"count":0,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/4774\/revisions"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=4774"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=4774"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=4774"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}