{"id":49358,"date":"2015-01-25T23:22:26","date_gmt":"2015-01-26T06:22:26","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2015\/01\/25\/marriage-license-shenanigans-in-oklahoma.html"},"modified":"2015-01-25T23:22:26","modified_gmt":"2015-01-26T06:22:26","slug":"marriage-license-shenanigans-in-oklahoma","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2015\/01\/25\/marriage-license-shenanigans-in-oklahoma.html","title":{"rendered":"Marriage license shenanigans in Oklahoma"},"content":{"rendered":"

It's been suggested that one possible (and appropriate) outcome of the controversy over marriage equality would be to get the state out of the business of marriage. Let the state recognize some sort of licensed civil union, and let folk who want a religious state of "Holy Matrimony" arrange that with their individual churches. The state ends up dealing with just the contractual rights\/responsibilities of folk getting hitched, and all of the "God intended marriage to look like this."<\/i> stuff gets punted back to the churches making said claims.<\/p>\n

An Oklahoma state law under consideration manages to take that idea and flip around the result. Under it, the state (or, rather, county justices of the peace) could no longer marry people. If you want to get married, as recognized by state law, you would need to do so in a recognized church.<\/p>\n

On the plus side, that would allow denominations and churches that sacramentally accept same-sex marriage to do their thing, and those that don't to do their own thing, too. On the negative side, it would have religious institutions dictating who gets to be considered married, with all the benefits (and responsibilities) the state imposes following from those religious actions.<\/p>\n

Those who didn't want a church wedding could file an affidavit of common law marriage — except, apparently, Oklahoma doesn't by default recognize common law marriage, unless a judge rules to so accept it. That both puts non-religious individuals at a legal disadvantage, and puts judges in the position of deciding which non-religious marriages to recognize, which seems highly problematic.<\/p>\n

Bottom line, there's at least a couple of very significant church-state entanglements involved in this proposal, though no doubt it's garnering some nice support for the legislator who proposed it. It would almost certainly never pass muster, but it's another example of the lengths to which some folk will go to turn back the social\/legal tide.<\/p><\/blockquote>\n

\n
\n
\n<\/a>
\nProposed bill would end marriage licenses<\/a><\/span>
\nA new bill being discussed in the State House of Representatives could mean the end of marriage licenses in the state.\n<\/p><\/blockquote>\n

View on Google+<\/a><\/span><\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"

It's been suggested that one possible (and appropriate) outcome of the controversy over marriage equality would be to get the state out of the business of marriage. Let the state recognize some sort of licensed civil union, and let folk who want a religious state of "Holy Matrimony" arrange that with their individual churches. The … Continue reading “Marriage license shenanigans in Oklahoma”<\/span><\/a><\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":1,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"_seopress_robots_primary_cat":"","_seopress_titles_title":"","_seopress_titles_desc":"","_seopress_robots_index":"","_seopress_analysis_target_kw":"","_jetpack_memberships_contains_paid_content":false,"footnotes":"","jetpack_publicize_message":"","jetpack_publicize_feature_enabled":true,"jetpack_social_post_already_shared":true,"jetpack_social_options":{"image_generator_settings":{"template":"highway","default_image_id":0,"font":"","enabled":false},"version":2}},"categories":[106],"tags":[],"class_list":["post-49358","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","hentry","category-plusposts"],"jetpack_publicize_connections":[],"jetpack_featured_media_url":"","jetpack_sharing_enabled":true,"jetpack-related-posts":[{"id":5631,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2004\/02\/06\/separate_but_eq.html","url_meta":{"origin":49358,"position":0},"title":"Separate but equal?","author":"***Dave","date":"Fri 6-Feb-04 9:52am","format":false,"excerpt":"Thanks to Les for reminding me about the Massachussetts Supremes' ruling on gay marriage. First, read what he said (which was mostly what others said, particuarly Solonor), then come back...","rel":"","context":"In "LGBTQ &c"","block_context":{"text":"LGBTQ &c","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/gay-stuff"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":25209,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2012\/01\/08\/the-gop-candidates-and-gay-marriage.html","url_meta":{"origin":49358,"position":1},"title":"The GOP candidates and Gay Marriage","author":"***Dave","date":"Sun 8-Jan-12 1:24pm","format":false,"excerpt":"Dear Mr. Gingrich: I realize your own sense of what marriage consists of may be different than most, and it's nice that you attribute a bit more to gay relationships than just depraved lust, but dismissing married gay couples as just \"friends\" is demeaning and arrogant ... just what we've\u2026","rel":"","context":"In "~PlusPosts"","block_context":{"text":"~PlusPosts","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/blogging\/plusposts"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":24151,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2011\/12\/02\/church-bands-interracial-couples.html","url_meta":{"origin":49358,"position":2},"title":"Church bans interracial couples","author":"***Dave","date":"Fri 2-Dec-11 12:03pm","format":false,"excerpt":"Obviously I disagree with this particular church's beliefs -- but I support their decision, as a private belief group, to define their own membership rules.The only reason I point this out is that the question all too often comes up about whether the growth of anti-discrimination laws against gays and\u2026","rel":"","context":"In "~PlusPosts"","block_context":{"text":"~PlusPosts","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/blogging\/plusposts"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":46006,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2014\/10\/21\/when-is-a-church-really-a-church.html","url_meta":{"origin":49358,"position":3},"title":"When is a church really a church?","author":"***Dave","date":"Tue 21-Oct-14 6:03pm","format":false,"excerpt":"The courts have traditionally (well, at least over the last century) reluctant to judge the validity of personal religious belief. But the law has been pretty good about defining actual churches, for taxation purposes if nothing else. It appears the \"Hitching Post\" is not a church in the legal sense\u2026","rel":"","context":"In "~PlusPosts"","block_context":{"text":"~PlusPosts","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/blogging\/plusposts"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":138881,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2019\/05\/25\/the-end-of-marriage-in-alabama-not-really.html","url_meta":{"origin":49358,"position":4},"title":"The End of Marriage in Alabama (not really)","author":"***Dave","date":"Sat 25-May-19 12:43pm","format":false,"excerpt":"Dropping most state marriage paperwork is a good thing for sketchy reasons.","rel":"","context":"In "~Tweets"","block_context":{"text":"~Tweets","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/blogging\/tweets"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/wp-content\/uploads\/2011\/06\/wedding-rings2.jpg?resize=350%2C200&ssl=1","width":350,"height":200},"classes":[]},{"id":5478,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2004\/03\/04\/dennis_dennis_d.html","url_meta":{"origin":49358,"position":5},"title":"Dennis, Dennis, Dennis …","author":"***Dave","date":"Thu 4-Mar-04 1:22pm","format":false,"excerpt":"I've usually found Dennis Prager to be an insightful and intelligent commentator on religion and society. I've listened to him on the radio, on and off, for years. I haven't...","rel":"","context":"In "Church & State"","block_context":{"text":"Church & State","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/politics-law\/church-state"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]}],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/49358","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/1"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=49358"}],"version-history":[{"count":0,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/49358\/revisions"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=49358"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=49358"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=49358"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}