{"id":5142,"date":"2003-10-28T10:54:12","date_gmt":"2003-10-28T17:54:12","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/?p=5142"},"modified":"2003-10-28T10:54:12","modified_gmt":"2003-10-28T17:54:12","slug":"carrying_a_big","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2003\/10\/28\/carrying_a_big.html","title":{"rendered":"Carrying a big stick"},"content":{"rendered":"<p>Okay, so this is third-hand information, and rumors at best.  But, if it&#8217;s true, it&#8217;s a disaster-in-the-making.<\/p>\n<p>Is the Anglican Communion looking at imposing a top-down command structure, a &#8220;Pope Lite&#8221; so to speak, to deal with current divisions?  From a <a href=\"http:\/\/www.ekklesia.co.uk\/content\/news_syndication\/article_2003_10_24_powers.shtml\">summary<\/a> of a <a href=\"http:\/\/www.timesonline.co.uk\/article\/0,,2-866214,00.html\"><i>Times of London<\/i><\/a> article.<\/p>\n<p class=\"block\">The Archbishop of Canterbury may be granted new powers under secret proposals to force rebel Anglican churches into line, reports The Times newspaper. The planned changes in church law would apparently give Dr Rowan Williams the power to intervene in the affairs of churches outside England for the first time since the Church was established by Henry VIII. <br \/>\nThe proposals, which would have to be agreed by the Church\u2019s separate provinces, have already aroused suspicions that they will turn the Archbishop into an Anglican version of the Pope suggests the newspaper. The powers are proposed in a legal document presented to the 37 Anglican primates who met at Lambeth Palace last week. <br \/>\nAt present, the Archbishop of Canterbury has moral authority amongst bishops but no juridical authority.<\/p>\n<p>Granted that a loose union can lead to irreconsilable divisions if they pass the &#8220;live and let live&#8221; level of contention (as the ordination of women did not, but issues of same-gender relationships may), the way of dealing with such divisions should not be the ratcheting up of legal power to enforce orthodoxy.  That rarely seems to work long for churches, and is usually more of a guarantor of schism.<\/p>\n<p>Bottom line, I cannot imagine the Episcopal Church acceding to something of this sort.<\/p>\n<p>And those conservatives who might be support of this sort of thing to crack down on &#8220;rebel Anglican churches&#8221; should beware that power is a two-edged sword.  If, for example, a majority of provinces should decide that ordination of homosexual bishops was a good thing, would they want the Archbishop of Canterbury to be able to intervene in their provinces?  Once there&#8217;s a whip to be cracked, it sooner or later ends up in the hands of someone you don&#8217;t like.  <\/p>\n<p class=\"block\">The paper emphasises that any new powers would be used only in exceptional circumstances. \u201cThere is no hidden aggrandisement policy on the part of the Archbishop and his advisers,\u201d a senior source told the Times. \u201cBut the present divisions are acute and need to be addressed urgently.\u201d <br \/>\nAccording to the paper presented to the primates, the aim would be to give the Archbishop of Canterbury power to intervene in the internal affairs of another province \u201cfor the sake of maintaining communion within the said province and between the said province and the rest of the Anglican Communion\u201d.<\/p>\n<p>How often are powers ever given up, when taken up in &#8220;exceptional circumstances&#8221;?  Not often.  And even when they are, the boundaries between &#8220;exceptional&#8221; and &#8220;ordinary&#8221; circumstances tend to erode pretty quickly when there&#8217;s such an easy out.<\/p>\n<p>This is, to be sure, only a news report on a secret proposal.  But I hope that the primates of the AC think long and hard before moving forward with anything like this.  Better a relatively amicable separation based on irreconsilable differences of doctrine, than a hostile rebellion in the face of dictates.<\/p>\n<p><small>(via <a href=\"http:\/\/www.blinne.org\/blog\/2003\/10\/church_draws_up.html\">Rich<\/a>)<\/small><\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Okay, so this is third-hand information, and rumors at best. But, if it&#8217;s true, it&#8217;s a disaster-in-the-making. Is the Anglican Communion looking at imposing a top-down command structure, a &#8220;Pope&#8230;<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":2,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"_seopress_titles_title":"","_seopress_titles_desc":"","_seopress_robots_index":"","_seopress_robots_follow":"","_seopress_robots_imageindex":"","_seopress_robots_snippet":"","_seopress_robots_primary_cat":"","_seopress_robots_breadcrumbs":"","_seopress_robots_freeze_modified_date":"","_seopress_robots_custom_modified_date":"","_seopress_robots_canonical":"","_seopress_social_fb_title":"","_seopress_social_fb_desc":"","_seopress_social_fb_img":"","_seopress_social_fb_img_attachment_id":0,"_seopress_social_fb_img_width":0,"_seopress_social_fb_img_height":0,"_seopress_social_twitter_title":"","_seopress_social_twitter_desc":"","_seopress_social_twitter_img":"","_seopress_social_twitter_img_attachment_id":0,"_seopress_social_twitter_img_width":0,"_seopress_social_twitter_img_height":0,"_seopress_redirections_value":"","_seopress_redirections_enabled":"","_seopress_redirections_enabled_regex":"","_seopress_redirections_logged_status":"","_seopress_redirections_param":"","_seopress_redirections_type":0,"_seopress_analysis_target_kw":"","_jetpack_memberships_contains_paid_content":false,"footnotes":"","jetpack_publicize_message":"","jetpack_publicize_feature_enabled":true,"jetpack_social_post_already_shared":false,"jetpack_social_options":{"image_generator_settings":{"template":"highway","default_image_id":0,"font":"","enabled":false},"version":2}},"categories":[27],"tags":[],"class_list":["post-5142","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","hentry","category-religion"],"jetpack_publicize_connections":[],"jetpack_featured_media_url":"","jetpack_sharing_enabled":true,"jetpack-related-posts":[{"id":4265,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2003\/10\/05\/gads.html","url_meta":{"origin":5142,"position":0},"title":"Gads!","author":"***Dave","date":"Sun 5-Oct-03 1:39pm","format":false,"excerpt":"Say it ain't so! The Pope isn't happy about the actions of the Episcopal General Convention this Summer, and is rattling ecclesiastical sabers at Rowan Williams, the Archbishop of Canterbury,...","rel":"","context":"In &quot;Religion&quot;","block_context":{"text":"Religion","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/religion"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":7259,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2005\/04\/13\/more_anglican_c.html","url_meta":{"origin":5142,"position":1},"title":"More Anglican Communion brinksmanship","author":"***Dave","date":"Wed 13-Apr-05 3:55pm","format":false,"excerpt":"While the Anglican Communion has been rent with divisions over issues of human sexuality, and the actions of the Episcopal Church and the Church of Canada on that subject, one...","rel":"","context":"In &quot;Religion&quot;","block_context":{"text":"Religion","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/religion"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":12274,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2008\/06\/10\/lucky_i_had_leviticus_to.html","url_meta":{"origin":5142,"position":2},"title":"&#8220;Lucky I had Leviticus to protect me!&#8221;","author":"***Dave","date":"Tue 10-Jun-08 10:17pm","format":false,"excerpt":"An interview with Dr Peter Jensen, Anglican Archbishop of Sydney. \u00a0 Dr. Jensen was recently quoted viz the current brouhaha within the Anglican Communion (emphasis mine). ...Archbishop Jensen is one...","rel":"","context":"In &quot;Episcopal Church&quot;","block_context":{"text":"Episcopal Church","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/religion\/religion-episcopal-church"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":128033,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2015\/09\/16\/sleeping-in-ecclesiastically-separate-bedrooms.html","url_meta":{"origin":5142,"position":3},"title":"Sleeping in ecclesiastically separate bedrooms","author":"***Dave","date":"Wed 16-Sep-15 2:03pm","format":false,"excerpt":"The current Archbishop of Canterbury is willing to sacrifice the already fracturing Anglican Communion in the name of maintaining a less doctrinally unified confederation of Anglican churches, all connected to Canterbury if not to each other.Which may be the best that anyone who has a fondness for the Anglican Communion\u2026","rel":"","context":"In &quot;~PlusPosts&quot;","block_context":{"text":"~PlusPosts","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/blogging\/plusposts"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":15215,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2009\/07\/15\/more-episcopaliana.html","url_meta":{"origin":5142,"position":4},"title":"More Episcopaliana","author":"***Dave","date":"Wed 15-Jul-09 10:23am","format":false,"excerpt":"So I posted the other day about D025, the resolution from the Episcopal General Convention that says, \"Yeah, we like being Anglican, but we think gays in committed monogamous relationships (which would be marriage if we, y'know, let them get married) should be eligible to be bishops and priests if\u2026","rel":"","context":"In &quot;Episcopal Church&quot;","block_context":{"text":"Episcopal Church","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/religion\/religion-episcopal-church"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/www.hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/images\/episcshield.gif?resize=350%2C200&ssl=1","width":350,"height":200},"classes":[]},{"id":9481,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2006\/06\/28\/the_limits_of_u.html","url_meta":{"origin":5142,"position":5},"title":"The limits of unity","author":"***Dave","date":"Wed 28-Jun-06 11:33am","format":false,"excerpt":"From a Christian perspective, there is value placed on unity -- \"that you may be One, as the Father and I are One\" -- in religion.\u00a0 This has been expressed...","rel":"","context":"In &quot;Religion&quot;","block_context":{"text":"Religion","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/religion"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]}],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/5142","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/2"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=5142"}],"version-history":[{"count":0,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/5142\/revisions"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=5142"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=5142"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=5142"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}