{"id":6041,"date":"2004-06-02T11:45:33","date_gmt":"2004-06-02T18:45:33","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp\/2004\/06\/02\/sealed-and-delivered.html"},"modified":"2004-06-02T11:45:33","modified_gmt":"2004-06-02T18:45:33","slug":"sealed_and_deli","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2004\/06\/02\/sealed_and_deli.html","title":{"rendered":"Sealed and delivered"},"content":{"rendered":"

LA County has caved on the ACLU complaint about their seal<\/a> (as earlier <\/a>reported here).<\/p>\n

Los Angeles County supervisors on Tuesday ended an emotional debate over the symbolism of the tiny gold cross on the county seal by deciding to remove it rather than defend it against a threatened ACLU lawsuit.
\nAdvised by county attorneys that the cross might not withstand a court challenge, the Board of Supervisors voted to seek a compromise with the ACLU — perhaps by replacing the cross with images of a Spanish mission and Native Americans..<\/p>\n

There was <\/em>some indication that the cross had been intended as a religious, vs. historic, statement when originally included in the seal’s design in 1957:<\/p>\n

But a review of the transcript from a 1956 Board of Supervisors meeting reveals that, at the time, the cross was intended as a religious symbol. After some speakers joked about what they considered an emaciated cow, Kenneth Hahn praised the seal for depicting “the cultural and educational and the religious life of this county.”<\/p>\n

Is that impermissible? Would it be worse (or only a problem) if Hahn had specifically mentioned “the Christian <\/em>life of this county”? Does what the seal mean to people now <\/i>(in parts and as a whole) outweigh what it meant then?<\/i><\/p>\n

I don’t know. I’m not sure that redesigning things to have a Mission and a Native American (shoehorned into a small space, unless we’re talking about a major redesign or dropping other elements) is going to work in the long run, either.<\/p>\n

But Molina, who is Catholic, quietly pointed out that “there are many people who argue that the missions were not a great part of our history. The reality is that they were built by slaves.”<\/p>\n

And, of course, there’s that cow that’s there to be butchered, those oil derricks destroying the environment, that huge pagan goddess, that Spanish conquistator ship, and all those other nasssssty symbols.<\/p>\n

We’ll see. <\/p>\n

(via Volokh<\/a>)<\/small><\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"

LA County has caved on the ACLU complaint about their seal (as earlier reported here). Los Angeles County supervisors on Tuesday ended an emotional debate over the symbolism of the…<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":2,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"_seopress_titles_title":"","_seopress_titles_desc":"","_seopress_robots_index":"","_seopress_robots_follow":"","_seopress_robots_imageindex":"","_seopress_robots_snippet":"","_seopress_robots_primary_cat":"","_seopress_robots_breadcrumbs":"","_seopress_robots_freeze_modified_date":"","_seopress_robots_custom_modified_date":"","_seopress_robots_canonical":"","_seopress_social_fb_title":"","_seopress_social_fb_desc":"","_seopress_social_fb_img":"","_seopress_social_fb_img_attachment_id":0,"_seopress_social_fb_img_width":0,"_seopress_social_fb_img_height":0,"_seopress_social_twitter_title":"","_seopress_social_twitter_desc":"","_seopress_social_twitter_img":"","_seopress_social_twitter_img_attachment_id":0,"_seopress_social_twitter_img_width":0,"_seopress_social_twitter_img_height":0,"_seopress_redirections_value":"","_seopress_redirections_enabled":"","_seopress_redirections_enabled_regex":"","_seopress_redirections_logged_status":"","_seopress_redirections_param":"","_seopress_redirections_type":0,"_seopress_analysis_target_kw":"","_jetpack_memberships_contains_paid_content":false,"footnotes":"","jetpack_publicize_message":"","jetpack_publicize_feature_enabled":true,"jetpack_social_post_already_shared":false,"jetpack_social_options":{"image_generator_settings":{"template":"highway","default_image_id":0,"font":"","enabled":false},"version":2}},"categories":[8],"tags":[],"class_list":["post-6041","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","hentry","category-zt-pc"],"jetpack_publicize_connections":[],"jetpack_featured_media_url":"","jetpack_sharing_enabled":true,"jetpack-related-posts":[{"id":6079,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2004\/05\/26\/a_cross_to_bear.html","url_meta":{"origin":6041,"position":0},"title":"A cross to bear","author":"***Dave","date":"Wed 26-May-04 9:32am","format":false,"excerpt":"The county seal of Los Angeles County (my old stomping grounds) is shown to the right. It was designed in 1957 by then County Supervisor Kenneth Hahn. The ACLU is...","rel":"","context":"In "ZT & PC"","block_context":{"text":"ZT & PC","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/zt-pc"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"\/blog\/images\/lacounty.gif","width":350,"height":200},"classes":[]},{"id":40259,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2014\/01\/01\/httpwww-latimes-comlocallanowla-me-ln-la-county-supervisors-cross-county-s.html","url_meta":{"origin":6041,"position":1},"title":"County Seals and Crosses to Bear","author":"***Dave","date":"Wed 1-Jan-14 12:03pm","format":false,"excerpt":"http:\/\/www.latimes.com\/local\/lanow\/la-me-ln-la-county-supervisors-cross-county-seal-20131231,0,1242704.story#axzz2pArh1A4VI was, mercifully, out of LA County when this kerfuffle last went on, but ... interesting.The seal shown in the story below was the \u00a0+previous_ seal, which included a free-floating cross (along with two stars) floating over the Hollywood Bowl. \u00a0The new seal is here:\u00a0http:\/\/en.wikipedia.org\/wiki\/File:Seal_of_Los_Angeles_County,_California.png -- that cross is gone,\u2026","rel":"","context":"In "Church & State"","block_context":{"text":"Church & State","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/politics-law\/church-state"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":16815,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2010\/02\/26\/taliban-aclu-acorn.html","url_meta":{"origin":6041,"position":2},"title":"Taliban! ACLU! ACORN!","author":"***Dave","date":"Fri 26-Feb-10 4:32pm","format":false,"excerpt":"Well, actually, this doesn't have to do anything with ACORN, but I figured it was part of the mantra of EVIL EVIL EVIL THAT IS INFESTING THIS NATION and so deserved a shoutout. So ... back in January, a teacher got in trouble at a middle school in Maryland because\u2026","rel":"","context":"In "Politics & Law"","block_context":{"text":"Politics & Law","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/politics-law"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/www.hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/images\/american-flag.jpg?resize=350%2C200&ssl=1","width":350,"height":200},"classes":[]},{"id":7712,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2005\/01\/13\/unstuck.html","url_meta":{"origin":6041,"position":3},"title":"Unstuck","author":"***Dave","date":"Thu 13-Jan-05 9:33pm","format":false,"excerpt":"A judge has ruled that the Cobb County school district must remove their goofy \"evolution is just a theory\" stickers from their biology textbooks. US District Judge Clarence Cooper noted:...","rel":"","context":"In "Religion"","block_context":{"text":"Religion","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/religion"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":16185,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2009\/11\/13\/proms-should-promote-heterosexuality.html","url_meta":{"origin":6041,"position":4},"title":"Proms should promote heterosexuality","author":"***Dave","date":"Fri 13-Nov-09 2:52pm","format":false,"excerpt":"Actually, I always thought one of the big challenges at proms was to restrain heterosexuality amongst the participants. But apparently the local grandees at an Alabama high school are a lot more concerned about an even more dire threat than what all those promsters plan to do after the dance:\u2026","rel":"","context":"In "LGBTQ &c"","block_context":{"text":"LGBTQ &c","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/gay-stuff"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":6121,"url":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/2004\/05\/17\/the_message.html","url_meta":{"origin":6041,"position":5},"title":"The message","author":"***Dave","date":"Mon 17-May-04 6:42am","format":false,"excerpt":"The ACLU often gets a (generally) bum rap for being \"anti-religion,\" when in reality it is anti-state-religion, fighting the state imposing official religious messages and stances on individuals. A good...","rel":"","context":"In "ZT & PC"","block_context":{"text":"ZT & PC","link":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/category\/zt-pc"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]}],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/6041","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/2"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=6041"}],"version-history":[{"count":0,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/6041\/revisions"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=6041"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=6041"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/hill-kleerup.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=6041"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}