Well, because of guys like Pastor John Hagee, interviewed at length (and with extraordinary politeness) by Terri Gross on NPR’s Fresh Air. While much of the discussion is on Hagee‘s beliefs (Biblical “facts”) about how the Rapture is coming Any Moment Now, and how therefore the imminent Russian/Arab
Invasion of Israel, as clearly prophesied in Revelations and the Old Testament, is also just around the corner (and how, therefore, any sort of Land for Peace deal is both evil and futile), the topics range from how all Moslems are called upon to kill Christians and Jews, and how Hurricane Katrina was, in fact, pre-emptive punishment from God (around minute 23 of the clip, transcribed by me).
HAGEE: All hurricanes are Acts of God, because God controls the Heavens. I believe that New Orleans had a level of sin that was offensive to God, and they are … were recipients of the Judgment of God for that. The newspaper carried the story — in our local area, it was not carried nationally — that there was to be a homosexual parade there on the Monday that the … Katrina came. And the promise of that parade was that it was going to reach a level of sexuality never demonstrated before
in any of the other Gay Pride parades. So I believe that the Judgment of God is a very real thing. I know that there are people who … demur from that. But I believe that the Bible teaches that when you violate the Law of God, that God brings punishment sometimes before the Day of Judgment. And I believe that the Hurricane Katrina was in fact the Judgment of God against the City of New Orleans.GROSS: So I know you’re very opposed to homosexuality, but you think that the whole city was punished because of things like the forthcoming Gay Pride parade.
HAGEE: Ah … this is true. All of the city was punished because of the sin that happened there in that city.
Which would all be sad but, well, there are folks out there with odd personal opinions about the world and the way it works — if he weren’t hobnobbing with movers and shakers in government and the Republican Party leadership (either out of faith or as shameless vote pandering).
For what it’s worth, my own opinion is that God’s punishment of sin in this world, if it happens at all (as opposed to being simply a consequence of bad behavior), is rarely if ever directly attributable or so simply discernable. And, frankly, why God would intervene in New Orleans, versus, say, Darfur today, or Yugoslavia or Rwanda in the 90s, or Germany in the 40s, or the Ukraine in the 20s-30s, or … the list of sin, of violations of the purported Law of God, in so many places
has been so much greater than in New Orleans, it renders the whole assertion nearly meaningless. Of course, you could chalk it up to God Working in Mysterious Ways, but, then, that would argue against being able to figure out when God actually is acting in the world.
And, of course, if you’re going to say that God directs hurricanes (and presumably, other natural disasters) with a purpose, what sins do you attribute to the victims of other hurricanes, tsunamis, earthquakes, etc., that have ravaged other cities, that made them such a target vs. other “bigger” dens of iniquity? If God punishes people via hurricane, is the rain that causes a slick street and an auto crash also a punishment from God? Or the heat wave or cold snap that kills some elderly or homeless
folks? And what are the lessons in repentance and judgment those are supposed to teach others, except to not live in places with bad weather or natural disasters, ’cause otherwise God’ll getcha, or at least might just take you out collaterally with some real sinners out there?
Feh.
(via DOF)
He could easily say that it isn’t necessary for us to understand God’s reasons; they are beyond our understanding.
Interestingly, he is correct about Moslems killing Jews and Chrisitians up to a point. The Koran does repeatedly extort believers to kill infidels who will not covert to Islam. Interpretations of these exhortations occur because at times Jews and Christians are considered ‘brothers of the book’ and given some freedom in their religious practices, and in other instances they are not. There is no doubt, however, that the Koran is full of calls for believers to kill non-believers. Not that there are not similar exhortations to violence in the Bible (especially the old testament) although those often refer to punishment of believers.
Yes, he *could* say that — but then to be able to speak with a claim to full understanding and comprehension of God’s actions (past and future) and judgment wouldn’t quite work.
I mean, I don’t think God’s comprehensible. I *think* I understand some bits and pieces of God’s will, but not enough to stake other peoples’ lives on it, especially when it comes to attributing events to God’s plans / judgments / whims / whatever.
I don’t pretend to be a scholar of the Koran, either, but, yes, my understanding is that it’s a bit of a mixed bag in a lot of areas.
I’ll note, btw, that while there’s plenty of “punishment” bits in the OT, the history of Israel is full of cases of the Almighty exhorting the slaughter, enslavement, and other violent acts toward the folks hanging out already in the Promised Land. Fortunately, we don’t have similar passages in the New Testament — most of the promise is toward individuals being judged after death or in the End Times kinda thing. Not that it’s stopped Christians from slaughter and enslavement of other peoples “for their own good.”
Yes, he *could* say that — but then to be able to speak with a claim to full understanding and comprehension of God’s actions (past and future) and judgment wouldn’t quite work.
I mean, I don’t think God’s comprehensible. I *think* I understand some bits and pieces of God’s will, but not enough to stake other peoples’ lives on it, especially when it comes to attributing events to God’s plans / judgments / whims / whatever.
I don’t pretend to be a scholar of the Koran, either, but, yes, my understanding is that it’s a bit of a mixed bag in a lot of areas.
I’ll note, btw, that while there’s plenty of “punishment” bits in the OT, the history of Israel is full of cases of the Almighty exhorting the slaughter, enslavement, and other violent acts toward the folks hanging out already in the Promised Land. Fortunately, we don’t have similar passages in the New Testament — most of the promise is toward individuals being judged after death or in the End Times kinda thing. Not that it’s stopped Christians from slaughter and enslavement of other peoples “for their own good.”
So what did Iowa do that pissed off God enough that He flooded major cities there?
And can we assume that the tenets espoused by the Boy Scouts are so offensive that they warrant sending a tornado to punish them, or is that still Iowa’s fault?
Or maybe these “acts of God” are just whimsy on His part. I guess I’m not qualified to ascribe motives to His actions, unlike Hagee and his ilk, who seem strangely silent on the topic.
Ummm….Avo, they Voted for Obama in the Primary, and we all know that, Obama, being a Democrat makes Baby Jesus cry.
Wait — would God have been *less* offended if the *Democrats* of Iowa had voted for Hillary?
Oh, wait, it’s because Obama is a secret Muslim. I forgot.
See people think they know God, but they don’t. I think Christians are very crazy and meesed up in the head. They lack true understanding of life ,and what it means to be human. I really am into my ow spirtuality an dit is working good for me. I just hate it when other humans want to come into and tell me I shoudl be christians. I am like back off. They say well the bible and I say well the bible was written by man. BY MAN and they say it was inspried by GOD, but so do meany other books. Like I said people need to find themselves and not be sheep.
Don’t confuse Christians
with pentecostal or charismatic
those people are screwed up
they screw me up
saw psychiatrist after them
to me John haggee is an emotional terroist
putting gods name on his opinion
hagee and peope like him
don’t represent god
they represent religion and false doctrine
pat Robertson said same thing abt Katrina
Jesus didn’t like his kind in the bible
it’s in there
he had issue with relugios leaders
they did with Jesus
they got the ball rolling with crucifixion
bottom line
god speaks for god
that’s it
god did not create religion
man did
church is gods house because man says so
putting god in box
hmm sanctuaries are boxes
Christians in many ways is oxymoron
Christian should be verb not noun
#1 cause of atheism
Christians
source
DC Talk song
I didn’t agree
until I wanted to be an atheist
just to be as opposite from bad christians
and this idea that somehow what they say
is god speaking thru them
no it’s not
gods opinion on things is not theirs
it’s not of god agrees with us
do we agree with god
god stated his ways and thoughts are not ours
bible instructs in prov 3:5
don’t lean on understanding
um religious people
I stopped leaning in urs
I am cleaning out the decades of false doctrine
and junk and borderline brainwashing
and I’m winning !!
uhhhh… i think christians are nuts.
but the people above me are either really smart, or really dumb, because i cant understand wth they’re saying!
Is there anything specific you were trying to decipher, Alec?
I disagree that Christians are nuts, as a category, but, then, I would. I certainly think that there are plenty of people who call themselves Christians who come across as nuts (and not very Christian), but …